Here's what Gabe wrote on the pro life issue. Its really a bit much to sort through. But here it is unedited.
I think the right to privacy is now an established legal hack that I can live with, but I'm not a crazy Catholic who believes in bronze age mythology. And if I did have to live under a mythology it would most certainly be the Dune trilogy or the Matrix films, which, frankly, offer more plausible views of reality and afterlives than does the Bible. As far as Latin Americans and their restrictive reproductive rights strategy well you should thank the Catholic Church for that. You can want liberation movements and policies that keep the bitches in their place at the same time, apparently.
I still think that Che and Castro were forces for good in Latin America. I would much rather live in Cuba than the client states of Honduras, Guatemala and El Salvador, where we just murdered directly or by proxy everyone who was a threat to our interests. I don't think the people that Che and Castro were fighting could have been won over with nonviolence. I just don't. I mean, I have some nonviolent ideas but I don't think they're going to work...Both national parties are moving us toward Mexico. Not good.
As far as the abolitionist/civil rights argument, are you making the insane and crazy argument that murdering doctors somehow helps kids? Or the women who have to take care of those kids? I just don't think, and I've said this before I think, that the pro life movement gives a fuck about women or children. People that cared would do what any standard western european country--where they show they give a fuck about you by their actions--would do by offering comprehensive child care, liberal and well funded parental leave, full funding for head start. I mean, that's what France does. Its called the carrot.
I also think that this link beats the Wikipedia link because it shows how much conservative pro lifers care about poor black women and their kids: they don't give a fuck. But that should be clear by all their other actions quite frankly...
http://www.alternet.org/reproductivejustice/150797/the_heartless_way_conservatives_treat_young_women_who_choose_to_have_babies/
And just as an aside I don't think forcing poor women to carry their unwanted pregnancies to term is good for women or for kids, their hated and eventually unwanted kids.
Gabriel Kierran Mccloskey-RossWell I think we're saddled with Pat Toomey because Pro Life dems betrayed Joe Sestak, although I think the prime reason that Joe Sestak lost is because of the economy. I also think that he should have run a more inclusive campaign and ran to the left of the president onthings like job creation. But the economy usually dooms everyone. Why didn't they stay home for abortion enforcer Barack Obama? But nice try.
Philip, My position on abortion is irrelevant to whom. Less than a third of the people in U.S.believe in abortion on demand. A fifth believe in no abortion at all, even to save the mother's life. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion_in_the_United_States. More women oppose abortion on demand than do men. More registered Democrats oppose abortion on demand than registered Republicans. You and I are saddled with Pat Toomey as a U.S. Senator because Joe Sestak insisted on pushing abortion on demand. Toomey did not win on Republican votes; there simply aren't enough in PA. Toomey cannot assemble an English sentence, but he will be in the Senate for six years. Philip you are a member of the Bar. Harry, Justice Blackman found in the 14th Amendment a right of privacy for a woman to speak to hr doctor in privacy about abortion. Where else does that exist at federal law? Would you agree with me that both federal rules of criminal and civil procedure specifically ban any claim of doctor client privilege? I will sight the exact rule if you like. You say you support Castro. So you support Cuba limiting elective abortion to the first trimester. Do you also support the Sandinistas eliminating elective abortion altogether? Did you support the Cuban government jailing Gays. As to violence only the Commissar brought up the conduct of the Cuban Army during the Revolution. Guevara presided over 15,000 summary courts martial that sentenced 10.000 people to death. Guevara carried out at least one execution personally. One does not need to be a pacifist to decry this. The smallest spark of civil liberartism should tell someone that is evil. Finally two points I would think would be obvious to you. First, if the Abolitionist and Civil Rights movements had not broken the law you personally would likely be a much lower life station. Second, As Black women have three times the abortions than White ones, America would be a majority non-White country except for Rowe v.Wade.
I think the right to privacy is now an established legal hack that I can live with, but I'm not a crazy Catholic who believes in bronze age mythology. And if I did have to live under a mythology it would most certainly be the Dune trilogy or the Matrix films, which, frankly, offer more plausible views of reality and afterlives than does the Bible. As far as Latin Americans and their restrictive reproductive rights strategy well you should thank the Catholic Church for that. You can want liberation movements and policies that keep the bitches in their place at the same time, apparently.
I still think that Che and Castro were forces for good in Latin America. I would much rather live in Cuba than the client states of Honduras, Guatemala and El Salvador, where we just murdered directly or by proxy everyone who was a threat to our interests. I don't think the people that Che and Castro were fighting could have been won over with nonviolence. I just don't. I mean, I have some nonviolent ideas but I don't think they're going to work...Both national parties are moving us toward Mexico. Not good.
As far as the abolitionist/civil rights argument, are you making the insane and crazy argument that murdering doctors somehow helps kids? Or the women who have to take care of those kids? I just don't think, and I've said this before I think, that the pro life movement gives a fuck about women or children. People that cared would do what any standard western european country--where they show they give a fuck about you by their actions--would do by offering comprehensive child care, liberal and well funded parental leave, full funding for head start. I mean, that's what France does. Its called the carrot.
I also think that this link beats the Wikipedia link because it shows how much conservative pro lifers care about poor black women and their kids: they don't give a fuck. But that should be clear by all their other actions quite frankly...
http://www.alternet.org/reproductivejustice/150797/the_heartless_way_conservatives_treat_young_women_who_choose_to_have_babies/
And just as an aside I don't think forcing poor women to carry their unwanted pregnancies to term is good for women or for kids, their hated and eventually unwanted kids.
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